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You may have heard of various color adjectives used to describe hydrogen production based on the amount of CO2 produced as a byproduct. Green hydrogen comes from renewable energy sources, powering an electrolyzer to split water into hydrogen and oxygen.
Blue hydrogen is produced from typical sources like natural gas, but the CO2 produced as a byproduct is captured and stored away. This decarbonization process is one of the reasons why companies like oil refineries and chemical plants choose blue hydrogen as a fuel source and feedstock.
In this podcast, Scot Bauder describes the important role that valves, actuators, and regulators play in optimizing and scaling these production operations in applications like steam methane reformers (SMR) and autothermal reformers (ATR).
Give the podcast a listen and visit the Blue Hydrogen Valve, Regulator & Actuator Solutions section on Emerson.com. Here, you’ll find advanced blue hydrogen production valve solutions that are not just safer and smarter but also more reliable, ensuring your operations are always in good hands.
Transcript
Jim: Hi, this is Jim Cahill with another “Emerson Automation Experts Podcast.” You likely have heard about hydrogen’s role as an energy carrier in global efforts in an energy transition to non-carbon sources. Today, I’m joined by Scot Bauder, sales director for Flow Control solutions for the sustainable industries, to discuss hydrogen energy, specifically the production of blue hydrogen, with a focus on end users like chemical plants and oil refineries. We’ll be discussing the crucial role valves, regulators, and actuators play in blue hydrogen production for safe and efficient operations. I’ll start by letting Scot explain what blue hydrogen is all about. Welcome, Scot.
Scot: Thanks, Jim. Just as you’ve promised our listeners, I’ll talk a little bit about what exactly blue hydrogen is, but I’ll also talk about the different colors of hydrogen. Hydrogen comes in many different colors, and really, the colors are dependent on the carbon intensity of the different hydrogen types. The two most common are probably green and blue hydrogen. Green hydrogen coming from energy sources that are non-polluting, like wind, solar, hydroelectric, things of that nature. And then the blue hydrogen is where typically natural gas is used, and the CO2 emissions are removed through the process of making the hydrogen. This is important to large industrial customers, where they have a large demand for hydrogen, and the blue hydrogen processes tend to support that a little better.
Jim: Okay. Got it. So, why are companies in the downstream hydrocarbon industries like oil refineries and chemical plants using blue hydrogen as a feedstock for their operations?
Scot: That’s a good question. So, these industries, the petrochemical industry and the refining industries, have been using hydrogen to finish and make products for decades now. As the world has moved to reduction of its carbon footprint from different processes, many of these large companies have adopted ESG and sustainability goals to reduce greenhouse gas emissions from their processes themselves. Again, you know, making a large quantity of hydrogen, blue hydrogen is a great method of doing that. It’ll meet their demands for their products, but at the same time, being able to reduce or remove that CO2 emission that comes with it.
There’s also many countries that have decarbonization goals that have been legislated or been imposed by stockholders or shareholders of the company. With that, there’s either carbon taxes from the government or a lot of governments also incentivize customers to help remove their CO2 emissions from their processes. We, in North America, and around the world, there’s a lot of areas that have natural gas. It’s relatively inexpensive, and it makes a great feedstock for blue hydrogen. And right now, it is cheaper than green hydrogen.
Many companies are investing in blue hydrogen, like Linde, they have a Nederland project in the Gulf Coast here in the United States, and then Exxon is also working on a project for their Texas Baytown site to add a blue hydrogen unit for that facility also.
Jim: Yeah. I see and hear a lot about carbon capture projects going on in different spots. So that really is a lot of activity there. Well, blue hydrogen is produced via steam methane reforming, or SMR, and autothermal reform, called ATR. What are the critical aspects of blue hydrogen production using the SMR and ATR processes?
Scot: Both processes have benefits. The steam methane-reforming root process has been around for a very long time. It’s commonly used today at the petrochem and refining sites to make gray hydrogen by adding the CO2 removal, then they can make blue hydrogen and, again, reduce those greenhouse gas emissions from those processes. Newer in this area is the autothermal reforming technology. The real big benefit it brings is efficiency. It only has one CO2 source in the process, and it, again, increases the efficiency and reduces the complexity of capturing the CO2, where steam methane reforming has a CO2 component in the reaction when they’re making hydrogen itself and then also a CO2 removal component from the combustion process.
Jim: That’s interesting. I was familiar with SMR, but I hadn’t heard about ATR. So, I’ve learned something here today, and hopefully so have some of our listeners. I know safety is a paramount concern for the industry. What are some safety concerns related to blue hydrogen, and how do valves play a role in helping to ensure safe operations?
Scot: Yeah. There are several areas in the blue hydrogen process that safety comes into play. One is the mitigation of leaks. We know anytime we’re in a process environment that valves and pipe flanges and those things can have leaks. You know, when we’re working with fuel gases, with that being natural gas in this case, and then a product of hydrogen coming out of that, it’s always important to have the right products that you can isolate the process when you’re shutting it down, and then if there is a need to shut down the unit in an emergency, you know, isolation products like KTM ball valves can play a critical role in that safe operation.
Pressure relief valves [PRVs] are always important to protect the system from overpressure during the process operation. Anderson Greenwood has some nice pilot-operated PRV valves that have a monitoring component to them, being able to provide data of if there is an emission or a relief action that’s taken, you may be able to measure how long that was, and then also help learn through that process. Those valves also have an inherent ability to reseat themselves after an event, which is important. Hopefully, if there is any event, it’s short, and those valves can help reduce those emissions to the environment.
And then the last thing that spans across many of the valves that are used in processed plants, Emerson isolation valves and control valves, we have an extensive line of packing systems that fit with the extensive line of valves that have been tested ISO 15848, which has become the global standard for packing testing, and then also, you know, just having tight non-emitting packing systems. And we also have third-party certifications and testing that’s been done to the ISO standard that are available with our products.
Jim: Well, that sounds like a number of things to address those safety concerns. And I know from the monitoring of the pressure relief valves, I was recently at an environmental health and safety conference, and that was a large topic just from a regulatory standpoint to really track what the emissions were, how long, the amount. So that’s really important technology, I think it’s growing in importance. So, what are the challenges related with SMR blue hydrogen units? And how can valves help address these challenges?
Scot: Yeah. So, with an SMR, probably the biggest efficiency or challenge is the fuel gas to steam ratio and, you know, efficiency of energy use and also the emissions that come from that. It’s important to have control valves that have been sized correctly. Those are the components that help control that process and the output of that process. Fisher has a wide range of easy-e globe valves that fit well within that process and can be sized with the correct trim & actuation to meet those needs. Teamed with a DVC6200 positioner that gives accurate control, again, will help promote safe operation of the unit. And then at the end, you know, it also improves the yield across the unit, increases the chemical and catalyst lifespan, and again, just brings that efficiency across the entire process unit.
Jim: Yeah. So, it sounds like energy savings, better product yields, some ways that the technology can help there. That’s great. And I guess similarly, what are the challenges with ATR in blue hydrogen units, and how can valves address those?
Scot: Right. That’s a good question. So, with the ATR units, the temperatures are much higher. The way that that process is designed with the reactor unit, the temperatures are much higher than the SMR. With that, that brings challenges in the right materials and the valve products that can help control and then isolate those units when they’re in operation.
A good valve we’ve seen there is the triple offset valve from Vanessa. It’s capable of high-temp applications and will seal tight, you know, based on the inherent triple offset design and the way that seal works in that product. On the flip side, the ATR, again, like I said earlier, has a single CO2 emissions. So, you know, having the right products and being able to control just continues to add to the efficiency that we see with the ATR technology itself.
In fact, both Linde and Exxon of their blue hydrogen units that have been built or they’re in the process of working on, are both going to use the ATR process. So, I think we’ll see more of this in the future. You know, these are large process units running, you know, large quantities of hydrogen. So, the efficiency definitely will have a payback in the long term.
Jim: Yeah. That makes sense, that the more efficient process should be able to win out over time. And I know that hydrogen is a tiny little molecule, and so given that, how does that impact the valve material selection?
Scot: Yeah. Hydrogen brings some challenges with it, just at the molecular level. You know, one of the biggest challenges from a metallic standpoint is the potential of embrittlement of those materials. Emerson has invested in quite a bit of hydrogen testing in the last couple years. We’ve done metallic testing, you know, where we’ve saturated test samples in an outdoor lab and then tested those samples after they’ve been saturated at a pressure and a certain duration of time, you know, bring them back, do mechanical testing on them, looking for embrittlement.
We have not found if the right materials are used, typically, 316 stainless steel or carbon steel is in the right condition. We’re not seeing any mechanical impacts from hydrogen embrittlement or really absorption of that hydrogen that would lead to the embrittlement. With that, you know, we’ve also been supplying hydrogen valves in the refining industry for probably 50 years now, and we’re not seeing failures or other issues with those products that have been used, you know, in the refining and petrochemical applications, again, for decades.
If we look at soft parts, packing, and gaskets, again, those materials, we’re not seeing absorption issues with the hydrogen. So, again, a lot of standard materials that we’ve used for many years fit well within these applications in the hydrogen space.
Jim: I’ve always heard that concern that hydrogen embrittles metals, but it’s good to hear through the course of that testing that you’re just not seeing it, that you’re not seeing failures from doing that. So that’s great news. I guess blue hydrogen is a cleaner gas because the production process of blue hydrogen molecules captures carbon dioxide or CO2. I guess, where are some of the common challenges associated with the CO2 capture process, and how can valves help solve them?
Scot: Yeah. So, again, the process that we’re seeing the companies use is chemical amine process, which has been used by the industry for a long time to remove CO2 and other gases from different flue streams. This technology is proven, it’s understood, and with that, we have experience. We know there are some inherent applications with the chemical amine process that brings noise and cavitation. An example would be a lean amine feed control valve. We see those valves cavitate based on the typical process conditions. Fisher has Cavitrol trim that will address that cavitation and remove that opportunity, and really protect the valve in the system from any cavitation damage.
And then another application that’s common in the amine process is a rich amine letdown valve. And common to this is outgassing, you know, depending on the process conditions. In those applications, we tend to use a noise attenuation trim. In the case of Fisher control valves, that would be a Whisper III trim set. And again, that will reduce the outgassing and then the noise that would be associated with that.
Jim: Okay. That sounds great. After CO2 is captured, what is the next challenge in the process?
Scot: Yeah. So, we’ve kind of walked through the process of how we make the blue hydrogen, and the goal is to capture that CO2. Now there has to be a path to store that or use it in a different way. Right now, we’re seeing a lot of projects that are around the carbon capture and then also into the storage. And when we get into the storage piece of it, compression will become an element in those processes. And anytime we have compression, we’ve got a compressor, and anti-surge is always a concern on those compressors.
We have technology with [anti-surge] control valves, as well as our optimized digital valve using a Fisher DVC6200, that can protect that compressor and ensure that there’s not a process upset if something does not go to plan. And then from there, once it’s compressed, you know, typically it will be put in a pipeline and it will be moved to another location for storage, whether that’s sequestration or, again, to be used in a different type of product.
When we get into the pipeline side of things, you know, those tend to be more remote. We do have some nice actuators from Bettis. We have some electric actuators that work well for modulating and on-off. And Bettis has also developed a new product in the last couple years, it’s called ECAT. It’s a pipeline actuator that has zero emissions. So, a lot of times, the pipeline actuation uses the pipeline gas as the motive force for the actuator. This ECAT actuator can use CO2 or natural gas and not emit any of that to the atmosphere. So, another nice piece, you know, removing CO2 as a greenhouse gas emission, this fits well with that scheme of not putting that back into the atmosphere.
Jim: Yeah. That’s an important technology as everyone’s trying to drive their methane emissions to negligible amounts. To wrap up, Scot, can you summarize some of the key challenges related to blue hydrogen production and the role that valves, regulators, and actuators play in ensuring reliable and safe operations?
Scot: Yes, Jim. Many of the challenges that we talked about in blue hydrogen production center around high temperatures, potential embrittlement of metallics, cavitation, noise, and high-pressure drops. Correct valve selection has a direct impact on a plant’s reliability and profitability. Remote applications are best served with electric actuation that focuses on zero emissions. We also talked about extensive lab testing that Emerson has completed in the hydrogen space to ensure that the materials that are selected resist or prevent embrittlement from happening in the hydrogen applications, and always important to select equipment that promotes safe and efficient plant operations.
Jim: Well, that sounds pretty comprehensive of how we can help the hydrogen producers and, I guess, on the consuming side of the hydrogen coming in, as we’ve done for decades. And I guess, finally, where can our listeners go to learn more about valve solutions for blue hydrogen applications?
Scot: That’s a good question. For more information, you can go to emerson.com/blueh2valves, and that will take you to our page, that will take you deeper into the hydrogen applications specific to blue hydrogen and the products that support those challenges that come with that process.
Jim: And I’ll make sure to put a link to that, the emerson.com/blueh2valves, as well as some of the other products you mentioned through the course of the podcast so our listeners can go learn more about each of those. Scot, I wanna thank you so much for sharing your expertise today with our listeners.
Scot: Thanks, Jim. It’s been great to be on the podcast with you, and hopefully, everybody learned something along the way.
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